citrus_java (![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
citrus_java) wrote2013-07-24 01:26 pm
citrus_java) wrote2013-07-24 01:26 pm
Entry tags:
Sisters, Lizards, Pretties, and Top/Bottom Dean/Sam
Sisters:
Heh, sister and I got asked today how long we'd been together (they had to ask me three times till I understood what they were saying, LOL). Which reminded me - I'd forgotten we used to get that question a lot a couple of years back. puts all those Winchester scenes in a different perspective. Though I insist that choosing to include them, and so many of them, in a text, means a whole lot :)
Lizards:
Every night, for the past couple of nights, and I suspect before that too, two small lizards meet at a certain spot near the ceiling and chat, making small noises that first drew my attention to them. That is so cute.
Pretties!
Oh, look at all the pretties![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
stir_of_echoes made!
It's interesting to me that Dean was the one directed to be more dominant, and Sam the one submitting, here, unlike in later seasons. In almost all of Dean's love/sex scenes in later seasons - and from what I've seen, almost all of Jensen's - stands there and experiences, gets kissed, gets touched, and reacts so beautifully I just- OK, back on track, me.I notice that in a lot of older fics Dean is considered "the obvious top". Did that change after that Sam/Ruby scene? Or unrelated?
I'm generally not a fan of the top/bottom discussion, I don't like that it links so many characteristics and relationship elements to a preference of position. Especially not when it's also linked to "being the girl", which bothers me from every one of my genders, and as a trans person too. ot to mention, having to define yourself according to your partner/force your partner to define themselves a way they don't like to keep your identity.
That said, when I disconnect it from the stereotypes and think about it as play, I like the role playing around it, like the negotiations it sometimes comes with, like the identity issues it brings up (and even more when they're Sam's, cause that's rarer), and most of all love having a variety of depictions. Since it's linked to so many things, it's lovely to be able to see the different sides of the boys in different stories, or even better - in the same stories. And it's awesome there there is so much fic in which there is definitely no clear top/bottom. I just love that there are many options, that are all considered in character.
Heh, sister and I got asked today how long we'd been together (they had to ask me three times till I understood what they were saying, LOL). Which reminded me - I'd forgotten we used to get that question a lot a couple of years back. puts all those Winchester scenes in a different perspective. Though I insist that choosing to include them, and so many of them, in a text, means a whole lot :)
Lizards:
Every night, for the past couple of nights, and I suspect before that too, two small lizards meet at a certain spot near the ceiling and chat, making small noises that first drew my attention to them. That is so cute.
Pretties!
Oh, look at all the pretties
stir_of_echoes made!It's interesting to me that Dean was the one directed to be more dominant, and Sam the one submitting, here, unlike in later seasons. In almost all of Dean's love/sex scenes in later seasons - and from what I've seen, almost all of Jensen's - stands there and experiences, gets kissed, gets touched, and reacts so beautifully I just- OK, back on track, me.I notice that in a lot of older fics Dean is considered "the obvious top". Did that change after that Sam/Ruby scene? Or unrelated?
I'm generally not a fan of the top/bottom discussion, I don't like that it links so many characteristics and relationship elements to a preference of position. Especially not when it's also linked to "being the girl", which bothers me from every one of my genders, and as a trans person too. ot to mention, having to define yourself according to your partner/force your partner to define themselves a way they don't like to keep your identity.
That said, when I disconnect it from the stereotypes and think about it as play, I like the role playing around it, like the negotiations it sometimes comes with, like the identity issues it brings up (and even more when they're Sam's, cause that's rarer), and most of all love having a variety of depictions. Since it's linked to so many things, it's lovely to be able to see the different sides of the boys in different stories, or even better - in the same stories. And it's awesome there there is so much fic in which there is definitely no clear top/bottom. I just love that there are many options, that are all considered in character.
no subject
I don't care who physically tops/bottoms in fic, but it bothers me when it's treated as a characterization rather than a matter of sexual taste. The thinking seems to be: being penetrated = being a girl = being weak, which is messed up at every step. Plus, fandom blurs the lines between bottoming and subbing in a way I find problematic. The vast majority of people who enjoy being penetrated aren't sexually submissive, and not all sexual submissives enjoy penetration, but in fandom "bottom" is often assumed to encompass both. I love fics where sexual roles are negotiated, like you said, and I wish that happened more often. I'm a sucker for fic where people talk about sex in a believable, non "Very Special Episode" kind of way. And it's cool that all the big pairings in SPN fandom have at least some variety in who tops.
On a selfish level, I wish there was more non-penetrative sex where top/bottom isn't an issue. I mean, I enjoy lots of fics with anal, and have written several, but I wish there were more where handjobs/oral/intercrural/whatever was the main course instead of just foreplay.
no subject
Mmmmm, I understand.
And a lot of people associate topping with size and muscularity.
Yeah...
(though topping strong bottoms - OK, no, Domming strong subs - can be so fun!)
I don't care who physically tops/bottoms in fic, but it bothers me when it's treated as a characterization rather than a matter of sexual taste.
Hear, hear. Exactly. Or, if it's a characteristic, it should be considered the fetish/BDSM/kink/whatever that it probably is, and a fact of bottoming/topping... even if it's a way of working out emotional issues between the characters, it's more interesting if not considered an obvious fact.
Uh, I love relationship negotiations in fic.
The thinking seems to be: being penetrated = being a girl = being weak, which is messed up at every step
Thank you! And that sucks for everyone, for people who are and aren't penetrated, or weak, or girls!
Plus, fandom blurs the lines between bottoming and subbing in a way I find problematic
YES! And also between being penetrated, and being passive, or - the one handled, or whatever, even without being submissive. As if you couldn't Dom someone while being penetrated. As if you couldn't sub while being ridden to desperation.
I love fics where sexual roles are negotiated, like you said, and I wish that happened more often. I'm a sucker for fic where people talk about sex in a believable, non "Very Special Episode" kind of way
Yesyesyesyes...
And it's cool that all the big pairings in SPN fandom have at least some variety in who tops
It's so great, I love that. And that there is so much fic in which that just isn't an issue.
Since it's such a huge deal, apparently, I'm sorta waiting for the fic in which after years of UST and angsty crushing on each other, the boys (any SPN boys) reach the expected make out session, but freeze as they realize they both were going for the same position. Somehow, that just drains all the passion and fantasy out of it. "Me? Top/Bottom? Really?" thinks each of them. Sam can see the gray, moist cloud of indifference he feels in his throat settle over Dean's face. He searches for word to - "You wanna-" Dean gestures towards the ancient motel TV. "Yeah, there's a-" Sam clambers for something - "a monster truck-" Dean provides - "Yeah". Dean grabs the cold pizza box, to occupy his hands. "You want some-" - "No, no, no no", Sam clarifies. They settle in to watch, each on their respective bed.
On a selfish level, I wish there was more non-penetrative sex where top/bottom isn't an issue. I mean, I enjoy lots of fics with anal, and have written several, but I wish there were more where handjobs/oral/intercrural/whatever was the main course instead of just foreplay.
I like non-penetrative (and creatively penetrative) too. I find those in Wincest rather often, if you like I'll gladly send them your way sometimes